Bible

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  • #41898
     t8 
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    ringo111,

    I said that Wisdom being Christ is my opinion. Also I said that I do not agree with you ignoring the teachings of the Apostles, because it doesn't fit with your understanding of the OT.

    I think that no matter what you say, you are ignoring scripture. So I end this conversation with you. I cannot go any further with you on this. You are not going to reason me away from scripture or the teachings of the Apostles.

    In fact I am not even reading your posts of late, you didn't supply any evidence as to why every NT has these scriptures, so there is no point reading what you are saying.

    You should just accept that I cannot follow you with this one.

    #41899
     ringo111 
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    Quote

    ringo111,

    I said that Wisdom being Christ is my opinion. Also I said that I do not agree with you ignoring the teachings of the Apostles, because it doesn't fit with your understanding of the OT.

    Off an opinion, You defend a belief. Why??

    I am conteding that it is not a teaching of the apostles. But an inserted lie. Which is a view supported through scripture.

    Quote

    I think that no matter what you say, you are ignoring scripture. So I end this conversation with you. I cannot go any further with you on this. You are not going to reason me away from scripture or the teachings of the Apostles.

    No-matter what I say?? I am not quoting out of some wierd books, I am quoting out of the Bible. It is that which you are ignoring, Not just me.

    My last couple of posts were really cool, hopefully you will read later on. When If you ask GoD about it, hopefully he convicts you by the holy spirit.

    I am reasoning toward sound scriptural teaching.

    Quote

    In fact I am not even reading your posts of late, you didn't supply any evidence as to why every NT has these scriptures, so there is no point reading what you are saying.

    The days are evil, and Lies are secretly introduced. Therefore everything is to be questioned. There is the over-whelming amount of evidence that prooves those three writings fake. This evidence is from both New Testiment, and Old Testiment. Which I have posted.

    Quote

    You should just accept that I cannot follow you with this one.

    Its sad, though Im not suprised, such is the way of humanity.
    I would encourage you to pray that GoD will Take your reality away, and that he will show you his reality that he has for you.

    Finally

    Again I ask.

    Why do you still believe that The world was created through someone when Proverbs 8:22-31 Clearly states that Wisdom was Born, watched god create many things, Then started her work?

    I believe that for you to rethink your belif structure is more than you wish at this point in time. I hope and pray that you are able to in the future.

    l8rz

    This Current Convo, is from a previous thread- It was started In the thread “Who is Jesus?”

    http://heaven.net.nz/cgi-bin….47;st=0

    #41900
     t8 
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    Quote (ringo111 @ June 25 2004,04:54)
    Oh yes, T8, You used those quotes to say that Jesus Is important. ^-^

    Yes Jesus is extreamly Important, And those quotes just proove my case even stronger, Because Jesus Quoted the OT, and said that the OT was correct.


    My point exactly. How do you know that Yahshua quoted the OT. Ummmmm, the NT perhaps. But wait, if the only record of Yahshua quoting the OT is from the NT, then given your belief, you have to question whether Yahshua really quoted the OT.

    Also if the NT is corrupt, then how do you not know that Yahshua is even the messiah at all. After all the NT could have been written in a fashion to make Jesus fulfill the OT.

    I think that your own belief makes the fact that Yahshua is the Christ sit on a shaky foundation.

    Of course I do not follow your reasoning.

    #41901
     ringo111 
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    My belief in Jesus Is not because of a book, but because of the power shown to me.

    I do not contend that the New Testiment is wrong.

    I contend that it is not scripture.

    I also Contend that it has been mis-translated, having added parts.

    I have allready stated how Many people who wanted to change the Meaning of the Christianity, only bothered initally to change the New testiment.

    We only Have one group in charge of the New Testiment.  

    For the Old testiment we have three. For the OT can be easily checked for the legitement writings, because of the other opposing groups who hold the Old Testiment. (Jew, christian, Muslem)

    I would say that this is why, the Old testiment was reguarded as the scripture, that is usefull for rebuking, correcting, upbuilding, by the New testiment writers. They were in the new covernent Yet, regaurded the Olt Testiment, as the scripture(new testiment, new covernent writers!!!).

    *think about it

    #41902
     NickHassan 
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    I guess what you say about reality being relative to your own perception says it all Ringo.

    But Jesus had a different teaching when He prayed to the Father

    ” sanctify them in the truth:thy word is truth.”

    We have to accept that The Word of God [NT + OT] is greater than us and submit our minds to it and let The Spirit teach us from within young man.

    #41903
     ringo111 
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    You do not understand what i mean, You have only read half of it.

    You have a belief, Which is your perception of reality, An unbeliever has that belief which is theyre perception of reality. You form your own percetion of reality by what you accept and percieve. Not that it really changes what is reality. For what is real Is allways there, aware or not.
    Its just like looking at a 3d picture. Look at it with cross eye's and wow, you see it.

    So I say, Because of this.

    Ask GoD to take away your own reality, your own perception. Open yourself to have everything about you questioned, And then ask GoD.  “GoD please take away my reality and perception, and give me the reality and perception that you have for me, that is the best for me. According to your will”

    Do you understand now?

    #41904
     NickHassan 
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    Abandon ship Ringo.

    Give up on your own perceptions . Let them die and allow the Spirit teach you new ones.

    We love to be in control but that just reflects our insecurity.

    We have little to offer to God except to be vessels [2Tim2.20] ready to be filled with the water of the Spirit[Jn 7.37]for His purposes.

    Just stop trying to think it all out and go with the flow of God. Obey God. It is so simple man.

    #41905
     ringo111 
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    Quote

    Abandon ship Ringo.

    Give up on your own perceptions . Let them die and allow the Spirit teach you new ones.

    We love to be in control but that just reflects our insecurity.

    We have little to offer to God except to be vessels [2Tim2.20] ready to be filled with the water of the Spirit[Jn 7.37]for His purposes.

    Just stop trying to think it all out and go with the flow of God. Obey God. It is so simple man.

    Yes, I have asked GoD, many times.  Why do you think I say to do so???

    I chalenge you to do the same. Use your money , get a sponser child. Then because if you lend to the poor you are lending to GoD. Then you will reap from sowing to GoD, and he might grant your request for a reality check. If he hasnt allready done so.

    And am open to being corrected in everything.

    Though there are some things that I know for fact.

    There is power in the name of Jesus, If you believe and repent. For I had demons haunting me for many years. Even though I begged god for protection, i was not protected, Even though I was small, and egknowledged jesus had come and died on the cross.

    It is so simple, Sell all that you have give to the poor, then you will have treasure in heaven.

    And also, asking GoD to forgive you, you are forgiven. For i feel the power of GoD protect me, when I ask for forgivness.

    ***********************

    Quote

    Just stop trying to think it all out and go with the flow of God. Obey God. It is so simple man.

    As for your final comment.

    *we are to be carefull, what and who we believe,for we will be held accountable. and test everything, because many faulse teachers went out even in the days of our apostles.

    Luke 12:57
    “Why don't you judge for yourselves what is right?

    Luke 6:39
    39He also told them this parable: “Can a blind man lead a blind man? Will they not both fall into a pit?

    Galatians 6:4
    Each one should test his own actions. Then he can take pride in himself, without comparing himself to somebody else,

    1 Thessalonians 5
    1Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.

    1 Thessalonians 5
    21Test everything. Hold on to the good.

    1 John 4:1
    Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

    1 Peter 1:10
    Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care,

    #41906
     NickHassan 
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    Hi Ringo,
    Once you are reborn of water and the Spirit you can begin to see the Kingdom. You can start to understand the ways of God and that vision becomes clearer as the morning star rises in your heart.

    Once you are reborn of water then the prayer we were given by Jesus to pray contains all we need to say to the Father today. The Our Father only can be our prayer when He has become our Father through that rebirth. It Is the prayer of today,for today is all there is, and in it is a prayer for forgiveness.It reconfirms our submission to His will and asks for all the supplies and protection we need to work in His vineyard today.

    #41907
     NickHassan 
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    Yes the Bible is reliable.

    It is more reliable than you and I or the theologians or the church leaders.

    It is the Truth and is written by the Spirit of Truth through men.

    It is the map and it is a light to our feet. It is enough for us and all we need to know.

    It is deep and multifaceted and we do not ever grasp it all.

    “Blessed are those who have not seen and do believe”

    #41908
     ringo111 
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    The book is rewritten by theologins. You are grosly ignorant.

    #41909
     NickHassan 
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    yes..and I know it

    #41910
     NickHassan 
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    “Unless you are born again of water and the Holy Spirit you cannot SEE the kingdom”
    Acts 28.26
    ” you may look intently yet you will never SEE..”

    Acts 28 .22
    “We know very well that this sect is denounced everywhere”

    #41911
     ringo111 
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    Quote
    Yes the Bible is reliable.

    It is more reliable than you and I or the theologians or the church leaders.

    It is the Truth and is written by the Spirit of Truth through men.

    It is the map and it is a light to our feet. It is enough for us and all we need to know.

    It is deep and multifaceted and we do not ever grasp it all.

    “Blessed are those who have not seen and do believe”

    Quote

    Yes the Bible is reliable.

    It is more reliable than you and I or the theologians or the church leaders.

    Now, I said, in response.

    Quote
    “The book is rewritten by theologins. You are grosly ignorant.

    Then you respond with.

    Quote

    yes..and I know it

    Why contradict yourself by seemingly aggreeing with me? Yet ignoring the main point. Your speaking double douch, and messing around.

    The main point is, Either the bible is reliable, Or it isnt!!

    Now, to sum up, You said that the book of the bible, is more reliable than “theologins”

    Yet , it is those ver people who translate!!! and the very same that change the writings of our current bibles!!!

    So then.. how can you posibly still believe the bible is reliable??? Knowing that the men who translate are not reliable??

    Knowing also the warnings handed out about men gathering large amounts of teachers to tell themselves what they want to hear.

    Sounds like most forms of christianity to me. There are so many books out there. Oh so many. Let alone how many versions of the bible. eek

    #41912
     Dinah 
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    ringo111:  not being a theologian, or not even being a devout christian,,,,,,but one who does believe in the Christ, and no man cometh to the Father except by HIM……for a time I could almost convince myself,  the WORD of GOD, was Satan!s ultimate deceit……..then having found the Book of Enoch…I realized it wasn!t the WORD of GOD, that was Satan!s deceit, It!s  what isn!t in the Word of GOD,,,is where the deceit is……..The O T  is true, if there be any lie!s  as you say,,,,,it would have to be in the N T……You see,,, the Father of all Lies ,,,,,was released from His chains,  Upon the birth of Christ……and one of His many chores ,,,was to influence those who decided what books of the Bible  were inspired by GOD,,,,,and which books weren!t……..GOD!s  most reveared Prophet, whom was called to Heaven before death,,,,HIS WORD WAS NOT FOUND TO BE INSPIRED BY GOD

    It is not the WORD of GOD that contain the LIE!s [as you say]
    It is Satan influencing the word of man that contain the deceit
     regard  Dinah

    #41913
     NickHassan 
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    Dear Ringo,
    We are all ignorant but not everyone realises it.

    You show that you have some scriptural knowledge-good
    You have some faith-good
    You say that you have had some spiritual experiences.OK

    It it enough?-no.
    Look in the mirror.
    Do you show the Fruit of the Spirit?

    These things were given to you so that you would find salvation. These things do not save you but only point to salvation.You have admitted in previous posts that you have yet to be born again into the kingdom of water and the Spirit.

    Nothing else matters -all else is vanity till we are safe in Jesus having the foundation stone laid, having walked through the Gate.

    “Seek ye first the kingdom of God and everything else will be added to you”

    Please

    #41914
     NickHassan 
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    Why should we take any notice of the Bible? The New Testament was written down from memory word for word recording everything Jesus said or did years after His death. It was written by ignorant fishermen, not clever theologians.

    Why do we even take it seriously let alone study each word and each comma and context?

    But that is the point. We can see it is alive and consistent with itself and the Old testament. It is harmonious and breathes God's spirit.It gives life and feeds faith.It builds and refreshes and nourishes our souls.It is more than a book.

    You can't have it both ways .It is either truth or lies. You cannot accept bits without believing the whole.

    It is our lifeline to eternity. Grasp it fully and escape the disasters awaiting those who do not believe.

    Love it,feed on it and live.

    #41915
     itsme 
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    The Bible was written over a 1,500 year span. It was written by more than 40 authors, from every walk of life including: kings, peasents, philosophers, fishermen, poets, statesman, and scholars, etc. The Bible was alwo written in different places, on three continents and three languages.
    None of the originally penned manuscripts exist. All we have are copies. The most reliable means of testing the reliablity of a document is the Bibliographic test for Ancient Literature. The test says that:
    The more manuscripts you have and the closer you are in time to the originals, the more accurate you can be to the original writings.
    AUTHOR WRITTEN EARLIEST TIME NUMBER OF
    COPIES SPAN COPIES

    Caesar 100-44BC AD 900 1,000 yrs 10
    Plato 427-347BC AD 900 1,200 yrs 7
    Aristotle 384-322BC AD 1,100 1,400 yrs 49
    Homer/Iliad 900 BC 400 BC 500 years 643
    New Testam. AD 40-100 AD125 25 years 24,000 +

    Bibles fufilled prophecies:
    Prophecies differ from predictions. Predictionss are merely guesses. Authentic Prophecies on the other hand, are from God–and are certain Promises!

    Fulfillment of Biblical Prophecy in the comina dnd life of Jesus.
    The old testament, a document written over a period of a thousand years, contains more than 300 references to Jesus' coming to eart and life on the earth.

    OT SCRIPTURE THE PROPHECY NT FULFILLMENT

    Micah 5:2 *Place of Jesus Matt. 2:1
    Birth
    Isaiah 7:14 *Born of a Virgin Matt. 1:18
    Luke 1:26-37
    Zechariah 9:9 *Jesus' triumphant John 12:14
    entry
    Zechariah 11:12, 13 *Sold for 30 pieces Matt. 26:14,
    of silver 15 and 27:3-10
    Psalm 22:18 *Soldiers cast lots Mark 15:24
    for Jesus clothes
    Psalm 34:20 *Not a bone to be John 19:33
    broken
    Psalm 16:10 *Jesus Resurrection Matt. 28:6
    Psalm 66:18 *Jesus' ascension Luke 24:51

    Many of the prophecies that were fulfilled were outside of his control. Jesus had no control over his place of birth, a friend's betrayal or what the soldiers might do to his clothing.

    #41916
     NickHassan 
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    ' matt 13.44
    ” The kingdom of God is like a treasure hidden in the field, which a man found and hid.And from joy over it he goes and sells all that he has, and buys that field.”

    A bit sneaky really. The field and the treasure in it belonged to someone else and we are able to take advantage of that treasure by underhand means. We did not inherit the field. We did not have the right even to dig in the owner's field. We were not honest enough to discuss the buried tresure we had found with it's rightful owner. We did not deserve the right to own the treasure.

    But it can be all ours forever.The work was done by Jesus and we are able to take full advantage of it while we are poor and sinful. That is the way of God.

    If we find these treasures too in the bible and bring them along to share with our brothers they can help themselves to them as well though we never lose them ourselves. Like a flame that lights another and is not diminished we can all grow in understanding by this sharing.

    We can also be advised by our brothers if what be believed to be a jewel may only be a piece of false gold or cheap trinket so we all gain .

    #41917
     Sammo 
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    Hi everyone

    Quote (ringo111 @ July 11 2004,08:23)
    I contend that the New Testament is not scripture.
    .
    .
    I would say that this is why, the Old testiment was reguarded as the scripture, that is usefull for rebuking, correcting, upbuilding, by the New testiment writers. They were in the new covernent Yet, regaurded the Olt Testiment, as the scripture(new testiment, new covernent writers!!!).


    Actually, New Testament writers considered books in the New Testament scripture too. Peter says in 2 Peter 3:

    Quote
    16 As also in all Paul's epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.


    Also, Paul quotes Luke 10:7 in 1 Timothy 5:18…

    Quote
    18 For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.


    Quote
    7 And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire. Go not from house to house.


    Should there be 66 books in the Bible? This is quite a cute little hint that the answer is yes: the book of Isaiah turned out to have 66 chapters, just like the Bible has 66 books. Isaiah is divided into two sections, the first 39 chapters being primarily to do with Israel, and the next 27 being primarily to do with the work of Jesus and the new covenant. How many books in the Old and New Testaments?!

    Coincidence, or the finger of God? :laugh:

    God bless,
    Sam

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